Are they any Christians???

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Re: Are they any Christians???

Postby Yukino114 » Sat May 08, 2021 2:07 pm

cacahuate86 wrote:I lived in Mexico for a few years, I know tons of people named Jesus. ๐Ÿคทโ€โ™€๏ธ


Lol if you notice there is almost always a Jesus in the credits of movies๐Ÿ˜‚ My siblings are like JESUS?! ๐Ÿคฃ

Do you know what Jesus means, cacahuate?
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Re: Are they any Christians???

Postby Jesus 2003 » Sat May 08, 2021 2:08 pm

Nope you answered it perfectly!๐Ÿค—๐Ÿ‘ Thank you.
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Re: Are they any Christians???

Postby Yukino114 » Sat May 08, 2021 2:12 pm

Great, let me know if you have any more questions ๐Ÿ˜Š I wanted to ask you, what makes you sure that the Bible you follow is the true Bible, I think it was King James Version you said, so sorry if I'm wrong ๐Ÿ˜… and what do you think is wrong with the other ones?
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Re: Are they any Christians???

Postby cacahuate86 » Sat May 08, 2021 4:37 pm

Yukino114 wrote:
cacahuate86 wrote:I lived in Mexico for a few years, I know tons of people named Jesus. ๐Ÿคทโ€โ™€๏ธ
Lol if you notice there is almost always a Jesus in the credits of movies๐Ÿ˜‚ My siblings are like JESUS?! ๐Ÿคฃ

Do you know what Jesus means, cacahuate?
Jesus is the Greek translation from the Aramic Yeshua, which means "Yahweh is salvation" (Yahweh is the Hebrew god) and Yeshua was Jesus' actual name.
It was a very common name in the area at the time he lived.
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Re: Are they any Christians???

Postby Yukino114 » Sat May 08, 2021 9:01 pm

Wow, thank you very much cacahuate. Another thing I wanted to ask you is do you know anything about why Arabic and Hebrew are quite similar sometimes? Do they have a root language?
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Re: Are they any Christians???

Postby cacahuate86 » Sat May 08, 2021 9:23 pm

Same language family. They're both Semitic languages.
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Re: Are they any Christians???

Postby Jesus 2003 » Sun May 09, 2021 12:01 am

Yukino114 wrote:Great, let me know if you have any more questions ๐Ÿ˜Š I wanted to ask you, what makes you sure that the Bible you follow is the true Bible, I think it was King James Version you said, so sorry if I'm wrong ๐Ÿ˜… and what do you think is wrong with the other ones?

So back in the time of the reign of King James there are many bibles in use the genevan Bible for the Protestants if I'm correct and the Puritan Bible for the separatists King James didn't like the fact that everyone was divided and using their own Bible when everyone was claiming Christianity so he had three choices choose the genevan Bible as the only Bible ever when used use the Puritan Bible as the only Bible that everyone used or find a perfectly accurate scripture that everyone would use. He didn't want to use the Geneva Bible because it didn't agree with itself there were several oxymorons as you would say. And he didn't want to use the Puritan Bible because they had very politically poignant and opinionated footnotes that people were using instead of scripture. So he gathered the best scholars of his day to collect all the manuscripts ever used or written and over the course of several years of comparing documents statements scriptures they came up with a 1611 KJV Bible. The reason why King James was so pleased with this Bible is because every part of it agreed with itself there were no mistakes there were no discrepancies between books everything was translated from the original Greek and Hebrew writing from the Dead Sea scrolls of the Jews preserved. Everything that they compiled is labeled the textus receptus. All other Bibles written after the 1611 KJV have taken out words have added words have simplified words and have changed the entire Spirit of the Gospel and have even created Bibles that are specifically tailored for people who speak Ebonics for Star Trek fans and many more. I believe that the KJV Bible is perfectly and accurately translated from the original transcripts that the people in the Bible days wrote on through the power of the Holy Spirit
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Re: Are they any Christians???

Postby cacahuate86 » Sun May 09, 2021 5:36 am

The Dead Sea Scrolls weren't discovered until the late 1940s.
The King James Bible was written over 300 years before that. I'm not sure where you've got that story from, but whoever told it to you had no idea what they were talking about.

The Great Bible was the first English translation of the bible (commissioned under Henry VIII). Henry was a notorious flip-flopper when it came to his faith but in his earlier years he wasn't afraid to take on great theologists and 'searching' for your life's philosophy is never a bad trait... nevermind the fact that he had a thing for beheading his wives when he didn't like them anymore. Catholicism didn't allow for divorce, which didn't sit well with Henry, who wanted to get rid of a wife or two, so Protestantism was a tidier option than just killing all of them.
Anyway, he eventually died and his eldest daughter Mary I became queen. Mary's mother had been Spanish so Mary was super Catholic and prominent English Protestants fled to Switzerland, instead of waiting around for her to get any ideas (she was a bit unstable). She died five years later and her half sister Elizabeth I became queen. Elizabeth's mother (the notorious Anne Boleyn), whom she barely knew before Henry had her executed for adultery and incest, had been a passionate Protestant and Elizabeth was all in on that. So the Protestant diaspora returned... and with them they brought a new translation of the bible - the Geneva bible, translated from the original Koine Greek, Aramaic and Hebrew and also the first bible translated into English that included the entire OT. Because of their time spent in Switzerland, which was very much influenced by Calvin and Beza at the time, it contained many elements of Calvinism. I personally think think this version is the most fun. Very fire and brimstone, passionate rhetoric and completely mad :lol:
Anyway, it took England by storm. It's the bible that Shakespeare and Oliver Cromwell used and it's the version that was brought to America on the Mayflower.
But... the establishment wasn't so happy about it because of the Calvinist stuff.
So Elizabeth commissioned the Bishop's bible and the Catholics wrote the Reims-Douay version.
After Elizabeth died without an heir, the King of Scots, James VI, became King of England - James I. His mother, Mary Queen of Scots, had been a staunch Catholic. Shortly after his birth however, Protestant rebels imprisioned her and forced her to abdicate. As her son was still an infant, she appointed her illegitimate half brother, the Earl of Moray, as regent. The Earl of Moray wasn't a particularly religious man, but he was a shrewd politician. He knew Elizabeth was too old to have any children and that his nephew would be King of England one day. And because of Elizabeth's relentless anti-Catholic politics, James couldn't be a traditional Catholic leader. Also, Protestantism gained significant traction in Scotland and it became clear that James would have to be a Protestant to be able to cling to any sort of power. So the Earl of Moray positioned himself as the leader of the Protestant Lords of the Congregation who, rather forcefully, demanded a reformation of the Catholic church in Scotland based on Protestant principles. So... when Mary got locked up he and later George Buchanan raised James as a Protestant, mostly through political motivation. See, Catholic kings and queens at the time claimed to have been appointed to the throne by their god's grace and since the pope, as their god's representative on Earth, had to give his consent, there really was no earthly power to legitimately dethrone them. Protestant leaders had inherent limitations, dictated by their religion. Buchanan wrote De Jure Regni apud Scotos which, based on Protestant principles, famously says: Kings exist by the will of the people.
So anyway, Elizabeth dies and James VI, King of Scots also becomes King of England.
James was annoyed by the warring factions within the Chrurch of England, so he commissioned a new version, based on the Bishop's bible Elizabeth had commissioned and dictated that it had to conform to the ecclesiology and reflect the episcopal structure of the Church of England. Basically, since religion and politics were a lot more intertwined at that time than it is today, he made the bible fit his politics instead of shaping his politics after the bible. Very convenient to be a king :lol:
So 50 scholars (all men of course, we're still in the early 17th century) sat down and translated again. As all previous English versions of the bible, the OT was based on Hebrew and Aramic versions, the Apocrypha on Greek and Latin and the NT on Greek. But more on that later.
And because it was an entirely politically motivated version, it had to be approved by Parliament. Which it was.
Since then, it's been revised and chnaged countless times... the last time was in 1985, when someone suddenly thought the word 'spirit' needs to be capitalized, because otherwise it'd negate the Trinity. Basically, for 350+ years the KJV promoted non-Trinitarianism :lol:. Modern reprintings almost never include annotations but in actuality and funnily enough (given Always' dislike of Calvinism), the King James version retained a good chunk of Beza's footnotes.
What's important about the KJV is that they did not actually translate from ancient manuscripts but rather from versions already widely in rotation, resulting in some very, very sloppy as well as intentional errors. The panel of 'experts' were entirely unfamiliar with Koine Greek, so they heavily relied on other translations (Greek based on Erasmus, Latin, Spanish, German, and of course earlier English versions) for their translation. But also, the KJV had a clear political goal and especially when the bible mentions certain terminology, the translators did not shy away from putting a political stamp on it. E.g. they just translated over a dozen different Hebrew words with the word "prince", even though each of those words in Hebrew carries clear distinctions in terms of how much power etc. the 'leader' in question holds. But it makes sense for James and his 'experts' to lump it all together under one term, given James' position. He was King of England, but he was also King of Scots (not Scotland!) - an entirely different leadership position over a different people in a different territory and most importantly under different rules. By making each of the different biblical leaders a 'prince', he equates all leadership positions with one another and his position as King of England, despite being a foreigner, becomes less controversial... Suddenly, prince is prince and king is king, regardless of the fine print.
But you also have to understand that these were times of great upheaval, progress and expansion for Great Britain. Not only did Scotland join England politically, but England had also laid the groundwork for its empire under Elizabeth and James. With that, a lot of foreign influences shaped the language. Almost half the English vocabulary has its origins in the 16th and 17th century. Because religion and religious texts, by the very nature of its content, should be conservative and conservators alike, they made a deliberate choice to use archaic language instead. Which is why the KJV sounds so grand, whereas the Geneva bible e.g. used a lot more modern (for the time) language.

Now, other versions have other problems. The King James version isn't any worse than other versions but it isn't any 'better' either. You just have to be aware of the political context of its origins. Which, I'm assuming, not everyone who thinks the King James bible is the be all and end all of Christian excellence is.
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Re: Are they any Christians???

Postby Jesus 2003 » Sun May 09, 2021 1:57 pm

Happy Mother's Day Cacahuate86 ๐ŸŒน I hope you enjoy your day.
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Re: Are they any Christians???

Postby Jesus 2003 » Sun May 09, 2021 2:16 pm

Oh also I just found the rules and read through them all, I'm leaving the forum because I'm Technically not supposed to be here and it's a bad reflection on Christ if I know the rules and disobey anyway. I loved talking to you guys though,
you were both great. Bye๐Ÿ˜”๐Ÿ‘‹๐Ÿผ
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